Interviews
Of Love between people, Interview from 25.11.2016 pt. 1
Of Love between people, part 1
Interview with Eleazar Harash
held on 25.11.2016 by Portal12
Hello, mr. Harash. After the deep topics of Atlantis, the Secret of death, the Secret of evil, which until this point we have talked about, today we will touch a topic that is slightly more on the surface of life, but is still connected to certain relations and to the deeper things. Namely, we will talk about the relationships between the man, the woman and the child. And so, let us start with this: What is this deeper thing, which makes people seek each other and create a family?
Seeking is a very important thing, but the Master (Beinsa Douno) says in one place: Before such seeking, before seeking others, you must have first sought God, because He gives the measure. – And so: if a person has not learned to love God first, in the right way, they will not be able to love others either, and therefore it is good for this seeking to be redirected. Whoever has found God, they are going to love people in the right way, they will love themselves in the right way, they will even have a relation with their Heart. The Atlanteans say: One has to introduce a Sage into their Heart, to converse with Them. – This seeking, of this Impeccability – completely different approaches follow from there on.
And following this logic, maybe a person can bring to realisation one interpersonal, true, deep love, from which a truly quality family and children may follow, if before that they have lived in solitude, retreat, and in search of God?
Yes… True Love – this is a participation of God. If God is not between people… this is why we come to this again: First is God, and then afterwards He is the Third One between the two. There is no way to have True Love without Him, because He Himself is True Love. First, we will explain the approach here, I will start in a bit, and then we will see what is the woman, what is the man. Because we need to have… we need to know what we are regarding – this is regarding a Secret of God.
Before we enter deeply into the conversation, the counter point of what I gave as an example and of what you speak of – what we widely see today – how people have a number of quickly changing relationships – does this not exhaust a kind of a reserve of feelings and emotions, which leads to a total impossibility for them to find the right person after a given period of time?
When the person themselves has not become the right person, then this is not only exhaustion, but they ruin themselves, they ruin others. All those who have chased God away… We have talked, and next time we will talk about the Deep Christian Wisdom and the Secret Christian Wisdom (there is a difference) which is even deeper. There we will see the Deep Waters that is this Primordial Christianity, which is now lost. But still, people aim for that as well, because there the matter is of a life within God, and a life within God cannot be untrue. People’s big mistake is that they desired to live without God and to arrange some relations, which cannot be true without Him already, because He is the basis, He is the foundation.
So, now. First I wish to say that when people lost the approach – the approach is primary – relations came. What is the difference? Approach is from the Spirit – Pure Spirit, and from the Soul, – and relations are from the mind. The mind is a fall. Relations teach you, approach changes you. In relations, in the mind, the person says “Yes, yes”, but they do not learn, do not change. The approach is something else, the approach is a change. The approach is Ancient and it is uncreated. Those who had the approach, heard the Ancient Voice, and those who lost the approach, became fate. The word fate comes from “judging”, “judged”. Judged humanity – i.e. this humanity. Approach is something deeper than experience – take note – even than experience. It is deeper than the world. It is Love towards The Ancient One, the Divine Creator. The approach is Occult Wisdom and experience is something which must mature for a long time, and if it becomes Spiritual and Wise experience, then we are already touching the…
And can we also say that approach is connected to our sense of intuition and to make here the connection with choosing the right person through the voice of intuition within us?
It is connected to intuition, “In Tao” means God Within, and when we have chosen God, we have chosen something more than what is right. Then He will choose our path, our destiny, and then it does not even matter whether you have a person with you or not – you will have God. Whoever has God for a friend, they are already above things.
The approach is a Shining Guide – in this connection, – while the person does not know where they are leading themselves – the ordinary person. Pure approach surpasses all methods and techniques because it is Love, not some technique. When the spirits lost the approach they became people. See – the fall from Spirit, to become a person.
And here I would like to explain something about the woman because this is a very big matter. We will not talk at all about what worldly people and the scientists say about the woman. Even when they praise her, they do not know what the matter is about. They do not know what the woman is, nor have they seen the Soul. They might give quotes about her, but they do not know… And this is why I want us to see what Ancient Masters and Sages say, because they are a measure. What is she? So, let us hear the Wise ones. The Ancient Thoth says:
The woman is an Ancient Flame of Love, descended from the Great Reason. When this Flame descended, it became woman.
The woman is another name for the Divine Soul.
The woman is a trembling of the Ancient Fire, of God Himself.
The Primordial woman was created as Endless awe.
So, there is nothing ordinary here.
She is a Great Soul, a Goddess descended.
She is a Great Mystery.
There are a few types of women: a spiritual woman; a Divine one – the highest degree; and an earthly woman – ordinary. Let us say the differences. The spiritual woman lives through the Power of the Mystic Fire. The Supreme, Divine woman, has returned into God. She is not seeking anything else, for her the world is poor, the other world is poor. And the ordinary woman – through her earthly desires she has scattered her fire, she is scattered. And she cannot collect herself, because she is thinking about survival, children, problems with herself, she has missed something Essential.
The True woman loves through the trembling of her Ancient Fire.
Here the matter is of Mysterious relations of Love, on a Deep level.
The woman is a Temple, descended from the Ancient Soul of God Himself.
See what we are speaking of?
She is a Mystery. Created for the gods, not for people.
This is why people do not have the approach towards her.
The Primordial woman is a Supreme Soul, composed of Sun.
Here I will divert a little. For God it is much easier to create the world, but when He was creating the Soul… (there is a Secret creation of the Soul)… It was created out of very condensed and special Sun beams. So, see where it originates? This is why the gods are amazed. People feel there is something there, but… we are speaking of gods, and of Sages and Masters.
When the gods saw her for the first time, they were amazed, because she was something from the Secrecy of God, something from His bursting into Flame, and they were in awe.
So, not just anyone, but…
In this Anciency, the meeting of Souls was the meeting of Suns.
There is no person to person here. I wanted to tell you what these relations lead towards. And if the person does not have this gaze, this outlook of the world, all their other outlooks… The Master says:
The Soul is from Higher worlds, of which we have no notion.
The greatest expression of Love is the Eternal Soul.
The Soul reveals the Boundlessness of Love; and Love reveals Him, Who Himself is Great Love – God Himself, the Creator.
Only the Enlightened ones know the Soul, the others are seeking it or talking something of it.
Now, if you ask me, I have seen the Soul more than six times. Twice of deceased people, four times of living people, which is amazing, but it has no explanation. To a certain point something can be explained… and by the way, it is not entirely non-material – it weighs 33 grams, says the Master. Very fine. And in the moment when the person dies, these 33 grams of fine energy, and something deeper than energy, separate… While the Pure Spirit is absolutely non-material, but because it is too fine… the Soul was created as an intermediary. Through intuition the Spirit enters into the Soul, and further down it cannot. And from there, the Soul transmits to the Pure Heart that, which must be transmitted.
And so, what does Orpheus say:
Love is the hymn of Anciency.
And he says:
My feelings are flowers.
See, what approach. We are not speaking of emotions here. Here we speak of…
Love turns the heart – says he, – into a Gracious river.
Love is a Mighty Goddess – and says Orpheus, – whoever does not understand her, she instils death into them. – when there is a violation… – and whoever understands Love, they acquire eternal impetus, an eternal flight towards God. – In this sense Love is created as a gateway towards God Himself and the woman can ignite this striving towards God. This is why… The woman is no slave, she is not created for inferiour aims. She is a gateway towards God Himself – for the one who understands and appreciates in the right way.
Your Love is a flame – says Orpheus, – more terrifying than any weapon. It cuts… – about Love, – …it cuts through both darkness and light. – notice, of what impetus is the question here.
Even the most ancient and darkest chaos knows nothing of the Origin of Love.
I am speaking of Love, because it is the approach, but whoever abuses Love, then strictness appears – the other face of God. Some call it cruelty – it is not cruelty, it is strictness, and it is strictness because it is justice.
The man is another Mystery, but if he knows himself as Pure Spirit. – Because he is not Pure Soul, but Pure Spirit. Here we are speaking of the initiated, of the True man.
This Spirit is Great Reasonableness.
The word Spirit, says the Master, means (as the closest translation to people) Absolute Reasonableness, not only to some extent – this is what Pure Spirit means. Absolute Reasonableness, and not just some reasonableness. It is given only to him to study the Secrets of God. – This is what the bible says. He can penetrate into the Secrets of God, he has been Primordially allowed, and he can come to know them. The Soul cannot. It can merge, it can experience Love, but it cannot know the Deep things.
Some things about children, but if you have questions… because it seems you do?
Could we say that there is, or more so, that there is not, according to your last sentences, a balance between the man and woman on their path from this materialistic level and fall, in the degree of development back towards the spiritual development? Is there a higher degree of responsibility for the man, or, respectively, the woman, in the process of returning to the Divine?
The big responsibility is everywhere. The man has a huge responsibility towards the woman. The woman should also have big responsibility and mindfulness. The child also has responsibility and, according to the Master, even animals have responsibility. Animals that attack other animals, plants that attack, everything is being written down, and everything carries responsibility and there is no such thing as impunity. There is nothing that is not being written down.
A little while ago, when you were clarifying about the Soul – how it was created – I will allow myself to add something, when does the Soul actually descend – during conception or during birth?
The Soul is already taking part in the actual process of birth. Invisibly it descends, it enters. Let me say something here, which some people will find interesting, but it is not merely interesting – it is words of the Master. The Master is the Supreme measure, He surpasses sacred books and everything else that you could think of, but this is another topic. Sometime, if we have to, we will explain.
So, He says: The woman does not give birth to the child. – He explains it as necessary: The woman cannot create even one hair, not even one fingernail. She cannot create the eye. If she creates the child and the child is blind, she does not know why it is blind, if it is deaf, she does not know why it is deaf. – There is yet another Secret Mystery here – where do eyes come from? Such matter is not found on earth, you cannot find it anywhere. I will tell you, without… because it is another long topic. The eyes come from the Sun, the Spiritual Sun. And after death they return to the Sun – their concealed part, the part that sees. The eyes themselves resemble Suns, and for the eyes there is another secret science, which here…we will not go down that path. The right eye is male, says the Master, the left is female. The right eye belongs to the mind, the left – to the heart. The right is connected to the Sun, the left – to the Moon. And the two eyes combined, if they are purified, can give birth to the Third eye, which already sees.
And the way that the Atlanteans see, now this is… I told you, I am preparing lectures on the Atlantean way of thinking. Here I will only tell you what the matter is about, so that you see how deep the Atlantean way of thinking is. We cannot imagine! For example, worldly people – if they see a wilted flower, they cannot see its beauty. In it there is an enormous beauty concealed. If they see a wellspring ran dry, like for example: imagine that you are in the desert and finally, you find a wellspring, but it has dried up. The worldly person (let me not say “you”, so as to not offend you)… The worldly person will say… They cannot understand that this is the Divine Conception, and that they must be grateful, and die with dignity, if they must die. What do the Atlanteans see, this is something unheard of, I will tell you: A marvellous thing it is, the dried up wellspring – it has returned into its freedom! – See, notice, what we are talking about. It has returned…! – First, the wellsprings (I will only divert for a bit), are created by higher beings. Because the wellspring in the earth, let us say the small one, it does not draw water from the earth, not from the sky. A sacrificed higher being – it renews the water. If people do not appreciate it, if sheep stomp through it, then in time – I have seen such a thing – the wellspring is gone. And people say “it disappeared”. The Master says no, the higher being took it back. And, by the way, whirlpools in the sea are from the devils. The big rip currents are from the demons. The wellsprings, especially the hot ones, and the right ones, the especially right ones… they are from higher beings, sacrificed themselves. See, how everywhere… These are ideas of the Master and the Atlantean way of thinking, which, if I presented them, people would forget all sacred scriptures. Because here… God Himself is not limited to holy books. He is not found only in the Quran, in The Avesta, or the Native American Indian bible, or in the Bible. He is not limited – people are limited, their interpretation is limited. Let me not divert.
Reasonable and conscious processes, or intentional – obviously we are surrounded by them everywhere and in everything, but let us just finish the topic on the Soul, i.e. does the Soul enter suddenly at birth, or does it partially, during the years, fill up, so to say?
The Soul instils gradually, but it does not fully live in the child. This natural joy, lightness – these are all signs of the Soul. Contemplativeness, a nice radiance… But its supreme measure is an exceptional striving for God. There are such children, for example the case with Bayazid Bastami, of whom we will speak further in time, of the Sufi… The Sufi are three degrees above the saints. Three levels… What Bayazid says at five years of age. He has many reincarnations experience in God, but that is another topic. What he says, at five years old, to his mother: Mother, release me from yourself. I want to devote my life to Allah. – A Persian Sage, awe inspiring. We will speak of him and of Al Hallaj, Al Hallaj is even deeper… She says: I release you – serve Allah. – And he devotes himself to Allah, and then he achieves certain degrees, which, truly, saints can dream of. But let us leave them aside.
Does this mean then, before we go back to the essence of the topic, does this mean that a big part of people today do not live their life completely filled with Soul within?
Initially, even in strongly striving people, the Soul is not entirely within the person. Even then. Sometimes it has to rest in the other world, because if the person completely masters… There is a law, if you master yourself, the world becomes harmless. Mastery – a master of yourself, a king of yourself. But here the matter is that, if the mind and heart are mastered, the Soul can already enter and live almost entirely in the person because it will no longer be a slave. So, the heart is the reflection of the Soul, the mind is the reflection of the Spirit. If the heart is very Pure, it becomes a light-filled reflection of the Soul. If it is impure, it is a dark reflection of the Soul. It is the same with the mind. If the mind is mastered, it is a servant of the Spirit and it cannot interfere in Sacred things and say “only my teaching is right, only my religion is right”. Because, what is the downfall of the churches, for example: They cannot love their enemies. And what does the Master say, take note, we will speak in time of the Secret bible: If you… – this was given by God, not by someone else – Love your enemies – end of! You either understand it, or you do not understand it and you enter the swamp. Love your enemies means: If you do not love your enemy, you will become an enemy of yourself. – There are no comments! You either understand it, or you sink. It does not matter that some might now say… Some even think that I am speaking against the church sometimes. Never! This is discerning. This is why we will speak of the Christian Wisdom, so that you can see what beauty, what Depth, what Divinity, we will speak of hidden Christians, and of some known monks, who… It is so beautiful there, that it is awe inspiring.
Talking about Souls, and in the context of the topic of interpersonal relationships – is there such a thing as Soulmates? And is there a way to recognise a Soulmate?
Souls, the Master says, were radiated, back in Anciency, in pairs, together. On Earth they barely meet, I will tell you why. Because if… They are so United, what one is thinking, the other is doing. The completeness is enormous, and there is something deeper than happiness. They are blissful, but Earth is not a place even for blissfulness, we will see later what the Atlanteans say. And the Master: Love has a Deeper mission than blissfulness. – At a higher level we must cast away even bliss, take note. So what were we talking about otherwise?
Soulmates…
Yes.
So, people who, in their purely interpersonal relationships between man and woman, say “you are my soulmate”, or the other one says “you are not my soulmate, someone else is my soulmate”, is this a delusion?
Now, people mistake Soulmates with kindred Souls. When they say “Soulmate”, they mean “you are very close to me, you are helping me” – yes, it is so. The Supreme Soulmate is… if it was given to you in this world completely, people would lose their development – not the evolution – because they would be engulfed. It is a very Supreme Love, a big overflowing. Blissfulness, and in a certain sense something more, I will not explain it. And therefore, on Earth they meet and touch each other to some degree, so that they give an impulse to each other. But usually, they live… It can be in the other world, there is such a case with an elderly woman from the Brotherhood. The Brotherhood were criticising her somewhat, she withdrew a little bit. One time she shared with me. She had no support, no close people, and she told me of one experience, in which she experienced her Soulmate. The experience was true, I weighed it internally – there is a psychic scale of sorts, a spiritual one, and there things are seen clearly. And she really experienced it, God gave her a gift. And this was her inspiration for her entire life, until the end of her life. She saw it and after this no one could take away her striving – and I am telling you, at an old age, until the end of her life – because this is something exceptional. You need to have enormous merit to be given it, and even if you have merit (I am speaking of spiritual merits, not human ones), then again, it may not be given to you because this world is given so that we develop high degrees of spirituality. Which are, including – above the Soul. And there are certain Deep degrees (there we are already speaking of the Secret Christianity) which are deeper than sacrifice. Sacrifice is an introduction, there are two more degrees, three… Anyway, let us not disturb…
Speaking of these deeper things, at least share what you think of the secret and silent love between certain Souls.
There are such deep experiences happening between Souls… And experiences connected to Spiritual Love, the other, higher – Sacred Love, and the other, even higher – Divine Love, that there the Word is totally excessive, it does not work. This is an experience that the Word cannot explain, even though I have Secret words in order to explain even such things, but again, I avoid… The Spirit can explain, it has the right words, the right Word, but this does not belong to explanation, because it is beyond measures and, on the other hand – it should not be explained because it is so Sacred that it must remain in this exchange between them. And I have told you that Deep feelings are – the Master says – an element of nature. This is why the woman can give an impulse for the man, for a Deep development towards God.
Can we say that this purely human love between the woman and the man must be such, that it is the pathway which leads the way to the higher degrees of Love, of which you speak?
This is exactly so, but we are not speaking of the human love because there are no humans here. In Love itself, the higher one, in Truth itself, there is no human nature. Forget it. So, here we speak of spiritual beings, of awakened beings, of a higher Soul, Pure Spirit, and something deep within the Spirit – this is the Secret Spark, which is even deeper. We are talking of a Deep awareness. And then, this can happen in the human nature, but it does not mean that this is human nature.
Let me tell you something about kids.
Alright.
The mother – I told you – only raises the children, she does not give birth to them. As I told you, she cannot create a hair, a fingernail… How the ear appears, how the heart is formed… A Mystery of God, and if God… Then, a child can ruin the parents. An example here, I am just recalling for a bit. Imagine that God sends a child that is crippled, blind and deaf. Now, I will explain to you the hidden beauty, because I see it everywhere, without exceptions. There are no exceptions. What I want to say: if the child is crippled and deformed, these parents have an old cruelty in them and God wants to make them softer, to transform their cruelty. In fact, next year we will be making a book on the Mercy of God. This is the concealed Mercy of God. That people may not understand us and that we might disturb – it does not matter, Truth is very precious to me.
This child can help their parents so much, soften them in such a way, so that they can in the next reincarnation… Because for one incarnation, you cannot fulfil the law “Be perfect as God is perfect.” from the bible. The saint is not perfect… they have a lot to learn. Really, if I tell you some things, we will disturb the saints, too. But I love them. Truly, they are children of the Angels – they do not have Wisdom, they have purity. They have partial wisdom, but do not have Wisdom. They are something very beautiful in this path, however, they are still in the long path of development. But let me tell you something about children. God gives birth to the children, the mother raises them. This means that the mother and father have no right to enter their own ambitions into the children. You love the child, you trust it and you give it freedom so that it walks its own path.
Imagine Mozart… If he was born and his mother wanted to make him a great artist, but he was born to be a musician. She may divert him, but then she will pay greatly – the child will have revenge, other spirits who are connected to the child will bring revenge to the mother and the parents. And they may bury the parents, because they are interfering with the child’s true nature. The child will show its character from the past, it carries it within.
And are there ways that the parents may use some method to know what the children’s vocation is? So that they do not hinder them?
First, the parents’ level is such that… There is a book by Brother Michael (Omraam) – a very good book – The upbringing of the child begins 20 years before birth. The parents themselves must be educated. There are no such schools to educate them, so the only One that educates children, parents, including Shamans, Sages – this is God. If He does not want to educate a person, even if a hundred educators come together, a hundred masters such as Christ – they cannot help the person – because God does not want to. The person has to have something within themselves that yearns sincerely to learn. They have to have dignity, have to have Soul. Not curiosity, but a thirst for knowledge – and then God will send a certain person, He will prepare them, He will give them a Master, and this Master then can disclose things which are found neither in this world, nor the other one.
Let me say something more about the children. The children are born so that they bring – says the Master – the lost Love to the mother. Because the mother – in this world, the mothers – they do not have a direct love for God – they do not see Him, do not understand Him, if they are left without a child, they may despair and go backward. And so God gives children – so that the mother can restore… Generally, every person has to love something, in this case the mother has to love the child – it is a kind of doll and also a Soul – it is at the same time something real and also… But she has to love it, to maintain this thread, so that in time she returns to Love. If she does not have a child, she should get a puppy, even an object – but there must be at least one thing that she loves. When a person loves something, they nourish this thread, and someday when they are ready… Because now… What did one sister say some time ago – she has three children. She said “If I was a true disciple of the Master, I would not have any children.” But, on the other hand – she has accumulated desires to have children, it does not mean that… The child is something beautiful. The mother can develop such love there, and then devote herself in such a way to God, that no one could stop her. So that she becomes a Soul, Fire, Flame – like Orpheus says.
And that…
So everything is in its place.
Yes…
Everything is on its level, there is no…
And this thing that the big spiritual teachers, as a whole in the world, do not have families, do not have children, is this an expression of their total devotion towards their calling to connect to God?
No, they… people would have to be very aware, so that… Whether a person will get married or not – this has been sown from past reincarnations. And in one place the Master says: There are people who must have children, and if they do not want to have any, woe unto them. There are others who must not have children, and if they want to, woe unto them. – So things are placed very precisely. The matter is: it is not so important whether you will have children or you will not, but whether you are devoting your life to God – not to the child. First to God, and then afterwards He has a way to help both you and the child in the right way.
The child is always growing – now I will explain to you why, according to the Toltecs. The child is always growing because it receipts. The old person does not grow because they do not receipt. They have already established viewpoints, incorrect ones, delusions, half-truths, they do not receipt. But here I will make a small exception: you have told me that now in Greece, in Cyprus, there are women who read my lectures, in a home for the elderly, and they translate them to Greek to the elderly…
Yes, that is right.
I congratulate these souls. There is… elderly people sometimes turn into children, that is what I wanted to say. And right now, because there is receptivity there. See, there are – not exceptions, but there are people like this, too. I congratulate these women – I congratulate you whole-heartedly, I do not know who you are, I am happy that you are helping these souls understand the Truth, because they will be reborn lighter, more rightly, in the next life. So, if you talk to them, send them regards once again.
Children are a secret world. – You want to ask something, or?
No, continue.
Yes. The child does not need your philosophy, but your love and trust. See how simple it is. Save your philosophy for yourself – it might be good, it might not be. Give your love and trust to the child; years after, if there are circumstances – tell them your philosophy too, and we will see if the child approves it or not, because it might have a Deeper Wisdom. We do not know.
Translated by Ruah Ezekiel
